Yeah, I know you like to use them, but there are so many misconceptions about what they are telling you, that I need to intervene and make sure you get it.
But before I go there, let me urge you to just buy The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living, and read pages 164-165. Phinney and Volek have the best description of this that has probably ever been written, and you should really just read it from them. If I could copy these pages verbatim and paste it here, I would. Seriously, it’s only a few bucks and it’s quite literally the book you want to own if you’re interested in low carb ketogenic diets.
OK, while you wait for your book to arrive, let’s dig in…
What ketostix measure
A color scale for acetoacetate ketone concentration
First off, we need to understand what ketostix actually measure, and more importantly, what they don’t. Generally speaking, ketostix measure excess ketones in your urine. They are considered excess, because they are removed from your serum and shunted to your urine by your kidneys. Their caloric content is thereby wasted.
Of the three types of ketones (acetate, acetoacetate, and beta-hydroxybutyrate) produced by your body, ketostix only measure acetoacetate. This is extremely important to understand, because it turns out that your body produces different quantities of these different types of ketones depending on how long you’ve been in ketosis. If you’ve been in ketosis for a while, you’re going to see a reduction in the “intensity” of what you register on your ketostix for two reasons:
- A change in the relative volume of the ketones produced/present in your body
- A reduction in the volume of ketones in your urine as your kidneys reduce the amount they secrete
Both of these are covered below.
Changes in the types of ketones you produce
When you first start your ketogenic diet and you are not yet fully ketoadapted, your kidneys actively excrete two types of ketones into your urine: beta-hydroxybutyrate (not technically a ketone, but it is generally referred to as one in the literature) and acetoacetate. These ketones are created in the liver in a roughly equal ratio (Note: Technically, acetoacetate is created by the mitochondria of liver cells, and from this beta-hydroxybutyrate is created and acetate is produced as a side product. (source)).
When you start restricting carbs, Phinney and Volek assert that at first your muscles use both beta-hydroxybutyrate and acetoacetate for fuel, but after awhile, they begin taking the acetoacetate and converting it to beta-hydroxybutyrate, and returning that to your serum. As mentioned before, beta-hydroxybutryrate is not technically a ketone. It is more of a “ketone reserve. When plasma acetoacetate concentrations begin to decrease, more of it is produced from beta-hydroxybutyrate” (source).
As a result of the continued conversion of acetoacetate to beta-hydroxybutyrate, the serum and urine volume of acetoacetate (the only ketone detected by ketostix) is significantly reduced. Your takeaway point is this: If you stay on your keto diet for long enough, the primary ketone circulating in your serum (and consequentially, present in your urine) is not detected by your ketostix.
Reduction in kidney excretion of ketones
Besides the change in relative volumes of serum ketone types, as you become keto-adapted your kidneys naturally down-regulate the volume of ketones they excrete into your urine. So even if you still had high-serum acetoacetate (which can be detected by ketostix), you’d still be seeing lighter colors on your ketostix because your kidneys are simply not excreting as much of them into your urine as they were previously.
The precise reason for this downregulation is not described by Phinney and Volek, but they speculate it is to prevent wasting the minimal amount of calories contained in urine ketones. Ultimately suggest that it is the result of kidney adaptation to sustained carbohydrate restriction (164-5) and leave it at that.
Even though we lack the sophisticated understanding of why kidneys downregulate ketone secretion into urine, we know that it happens and we know that the volume of acetoacetate in your serum drops as you become more fully ketoadapted.
So quite literally, after a few weeks into your low carb ketogenic diet, you’ll likely start seeing a change in your ketone levels as measured by ketostix. This is completely normal and does not mean you are having trouble with your diet. It doesn’t even suggest that you aren’t in ketosis anymore, because it can’t. Ketosticks are unable to measure the type of ketone that constitutes the majority present in your blood and urine at this point.
This doesn’t mean you have no way to monitor your ketosis: If you really want to know something important about ketones, you’d measure your serum beta-hydroxybutyrate levels. This is possible by using a portable device like the Abbot Laboratories Precision Xtra Glucose and Ketone Monitoring System. If you go this route, you’ll also have to buy their very expensive and proprietary Precision Xtra Ketone Test Strips to use with it. And when I say expensive, I’m serious. You’re looking at ~$5.00 each time you test.
So you can spend the money and keep an eye on your ketone levels by measuring serum levels, or you could just not spend money on ketostix and expensive testing gizmos. As long as you eat 20g of net carbs a day (or less), you are pretty much guaranteed to stay in ketosis.
Resources
- The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living
- Precision Xtra Blood Glucose and Ketone Monitoring System
- Precision Xtra Ketone Test Strips
- Ketostix
Measuring ketones becomes an obsession and I’ve stopped doing it. Most important is eating clean and seeing how my clothes fit, how I feel and if I’m losing weight. At my age and weight that’s all that matters.
I think I stopped measuring daily at about the 12 month mark, and during the last eight months or so of that, I was being told they were registering light because I was well hydrated.
If you’re going to use them, might as well understand what they tell you.
Hi Michael, so I just started doing keto. I waited 3 days and the stick was dark purple and then the next day it was a lighter shade, I think it’s because I drank a lot of water the second time. I know the color doesn’t matter but is it ok to be at purple?
Hi Althea!
That’s a great question, and not uncommon amongst people new to low carb.
Barring some exceedingly unlikely scenario, it’s not a major cause of concern for you to see dark purple on your ketostix. Or to see dark purple one day (or hour) and light purple the next (day or hour). They fluctuate frequently. I can get them to read dark purple just by measuring some time after consuming coconut oil (or other MCT).
If you are feeling unwell (likely to the point of wanting to see a Dr. anyways) and note a chronically dark reading on the ketostix, then you should bring it up with her when you have your appointment.
I’ve seen many doctors post videos about rhe ketogenic diet and they recommend no longer than doing it for a 3-6 month period yet I see people on this diet for years thriving. Can you she’d some light on that?
Thank you so much for putting that on there. I’ve been doing the keto diet over the years. Normally I stay around 40 carbs a day to maintain and less than 20 to lose. I found the same thing that the Ketone sticks are helpful when you first start if you don’t understand ketosis but after a while I don’t believe it they actually show your true progress. If you need a yardstick to measure by your clothing Works wonderful. If your clothes are fitting better or too big it’s a great sign that you’re doing things right. If they’re getting snug you need to revisit your foods and find those hidden carbs. Thanks again Michael.
What does it mean if I’m inbetween the small colour and medium I just started the keto diet today is my 3rd day. Am I in proper ketosis?
It (usually) means you are in ketosis. Try to think of it as a state you are either in, or not. Trying to interpret the ketostix as a measure of the “strength” of your ketosis is incredibly problematic (and likely, inaccurate).
I will have surgery soon with general anesthesia. Will I be kicked out of ketosis when they hook me to an IV drip? Surely there will be glucose in it.
I have never shown Ketosis on my stick why?
Same with me…am I doing something wrong?
Even after achieving deep purple, I have found the ketone strip test effective still in the morning when I first wake up. Regardless of how long I’ve been in ketosis. Basically from my experience, even if you don’t see a shade of purple you can certainly be in deep ketosis. Personally, I only use Keto sticks to Restart ketosis and to see when my body adapts/ regulates the ketones.
Thats good, your blog is cool, i like it. Thanks for the efforts my friend.
I have been keto long enough and I train hard, I can pretty much tell when I am getting carb creep. Performance suffers quite obviously…
This blood ketone testing is obviously ideal but out of my price range.
I can “feel” when I am doing it right, I just go by that now mostly.
Regards
Yeah. I think for most people, testing is not necessary. Still, I know new people get reassurance from it, so I figured it would be best to help them understand what they are actually measuring, and how they can expect those measurements to change over time.
-Michael
I like using them. Regardless of what you say, I think they do matter. If I started eating lots of carbs, I doubt they’d be showing much of anything. I would use the blood measuring ketone device, but as you point out, it’s very expensive – especially the strips – so forget that. I just wonder when the ketosis sticks will lighten up, particularly if one has a significant amount of weight to lose. I’ve been doing the ketogenic diet for over a year, & the sticks still show a varying degree of color, from light pink to almost purple. I’m sure many factors affect the color of the sticks, but I Do like to use them. They keep me on track. I feel like I am doing something. I also do not eat as low as 20 carbs a day. Or I might, perhaps. I don’t measure any of that. I just try my best to eat the foods that a ketosis diet recommends. The Phinney book is way confusing for someone like me. I’m no scientist nor am I trying to be. My diet is not perfect. It’s too much information, even, to take in. So, do things my own way. That’s actually working for me – I AM seeing results, both in weight loss & more energy. Before you are too quick to lecture people to dispense w/the sticks, consider that they can be very helpful, as the color can be very satisfying. Seeing that pink to light purple helps me. It may not be measuring much, but it’s measuring Something. If I ate a regular, high carb diet, the sticks would not turn any color, would they? I just need to know at what point they stop turning a color because of all you write of – and not because of any excessive carb eating on my part. Is it when one approaches a goal weight? After over a year, my sticks still turn colors. I’m happy about that. We are all not Jimmy Moore. We all can’t afford to buy the latest gadgets to measure our ketones. The sticks are extremely inexpensive, another reason I like them. I think your points are valid, too. It’s not either/or for me. I like the sticks & I appreciate your points. This all can be very stressful too. There is So Much info on this diet & ones like it. After a while I just don’t want to get side-tracked w/too much info. Some helps, but at some point I need to back away from all the opinions, views & info on this diet. The best thing I can do is see how the diet affects ME. And so far, it’s working rather nicely. Thanks for reading all this.
Wow! Thanks for your awesome comment, Zell!
First off, congratulations on finding a way of eating that is working for you, and helping you attain your desired weight. I think that at the end of the day, that’s the most important thing each of us has to accomplish.
Second off, if ketostix help you, by all means, keep using them. I used them for a year while eating a diet strictly limited to 20g/carbs a day (or less). While eating at that level pretty much guarantees I’ll stay in ketosis (with some exceptions), they absolutely did help me stay on track. I was measuring 2x day (once in the morning, once in the evening) and it really was a fundamental part of my routine as I transitioned from the Standard American Diet (SAD) to a more healthy way of eating.
It is not my intent to discourage people from using the ketostix (see Do I Need Ketostix?), but rather to help them understand what they are measuring, what they are not measuring, and how those measurements might change over time. This is something that I didn’t know for a long time, and most of the explanations I got were just plain wrong. While it’s nice to know that ketostix measure acetoacetate (and not acetone or beta-hydroxybutyrate), the important thing for me was to understand that even if I’m doing everything right on my diet, I can still measure very light colors on my ketostix and there are other reasons for this besides “hydration”. I see a lot of people stressing over light colors, and maybe this post will help them understand that they shouldn’t worry over it unless they suspect they are not eating properly.
And yes, you are correct…if you ate a significant amount of carbohydrate (and continued to do so, your sticks would stop registering ketones (or register trace amounts). And this is kind of at the heart of the post: you can register low levels of ketones on ketostix for two diametrically opposed reasons: you are doing your diet well and have been doing so for a significant amount of time, OR you are doing your diet wrong by eating the wrong foods/cheating and throwing yourself out of ketosis. There is no way to tell what’s actually going on with ketostix.
While I notice that after a 1.5 years on low carb, my sticks are mostly very light pink (and I assume this is for the reasons described above), I do know that if I ingest MCT oils (in coconut oil, typically) they will turn dark, regardless.
And for the record, I don’t measure my blood ketones either. While I’d love to be able to record such data, I just can’t justify the budget required for doing so at this point. If this ever changes, I’m sure I’ll write about it.
Thanks again for your post. I tried to answer your questions, but if I raised more or missed something, please let me know and I’ll respond.
-Michael
First of all, thanks so much for sharing your info. I have been trying to find an answer as to why my Ketosticks continue to show deep purple even after 7 wks of very strict low carb moderate protein. I think you may have answered my question. When I started LCHF my appetite dropped drastically. After losing 10 lbs in the first 11 days the weight loss stopped after 2 weeks I did a lot of research and everything pointed toward too little calories. I started calculating my caloric intake and found that I was only eating between 500-800 calories a day. I have always been a big eater with strong food cravings but that all went away almost immediately after starting LCHF. Now I stay full and can only bring myself to eat lunch and maybe a small dinner. My solution to that was to drink 2-3 cups of coffee with 1tbsp butter and 1 tbsp coconut oil for extra calories. I also cook in coconut oil. Is the coconut oil what is keeping the ketosticks reading dark purple? Is there any reason not to consume 2-3 tbsp of coconut oil a day? As a side note, after starting my “fat coffee” my weight loss has started again and I have lost 20 lbs total in 7 weeks. Thanks for any info.
Thanks for your info I’m doing lindora with the same exact results you described losing 12 lbs in 11 days and now no loss I have no color or a trace ,but the 54 carbs is too much for me to eat daily so the fat coffee and coconut oil I’ll be adding today
They can’t tell me why I’m not losing ,but keep pushing protein days and buying more of their proteins to no avail today is my one month on the program and I’m still at 12 lbs so your info really peaked my interest .
You might need to carb cycle to kick start your weight loss again. Works well for me. Lots of info out there if you google it. Also dont forget exercise especially resistance training….and of course staying hydrated. Also could be stress, lack of sleep, etc…. all play a part of the overall health and success. Best of luck to you.
in morning I’m small/ moderate ketosis and in the evening I’m dark purple , is this normal?
i had ten pounds to lose, so I researched the ketostix, and many people noted they did it first thing early morning because urine is concentrated, some people did right after dinner. I did first thing in the morning at the three day mark , and the stix was purple and remained there for many days, . I stopped using the stix after ten days I could feel my waist and that told me where I was and I could wear my once tight pants comfortably and no longer felt like the incredible hulk where the pants splits at the seams and goes flying off of you! HA
Zell, thank you for expressing your feelings…they are almost an exact expression of my own feelings as well. The Keto sticks are motivators for me and I will continue to use them regularly. Sometimes I think my brain will explode with all this scientific data, although, like you, I appreciate that their is a science behind how it works. God bless the folks who help the rest of us because they do totally understand the biology. But don’t take away one of the really ‘fun’ and motivating parts (for me) of following a ketogenic way of eating.
Gosh you are rude. He’s not lecturing anyone – just sharing information. I search for this article for a reason and what he has written and published FOR FREE, simply to HELP people is brilliant. Maybe before criticising someone, look at your own efforts to support and guide people that are looking for help. I hope your negative feedback doesn’t deter this person from offering help in the future, to people like me who value it.
Michael,
Thanks! I think it speaks Volumes about you & your fine blog, that you answered my post in such a Considerate & Helpful manner! (I was afraid that my saying I actually like to use the sticks might be seen as 1. stupid or 2. confrontational – or Both). One thing I’ve noticed is that there are people can get Very Intense about diet issues! You don’t seem to be this way. You’ve answered my questions & I really appreciate this! I think it’s very interesting that eating coconut oil might make the sticks darker. I really Love coconut oil – organic & unrefined. I think I will bump up my consumption of it, as a Ketogenic diet is higher in fat than protein. That’s one thing I’ve learned. (I started out, over a year ago, doing Atkins Induction, but now I’m trying to find high fat foods mainly, such as avocados. Most high fat foods that are acceptable on this diet do also seem to be moderate to high protein). Well, one thing I noticed w/the sticks is that they’ve consistently turned a color for me, from light pink to mid-purple, since I’ve been using them) – except for ONE TIME – last week, in fact. I went out to eat at a special dinner & I ordered the prime rib, but it seemed to be covered in a very sweet sauce (this dinner had been pre-ordered, so I wasn’t able to make a request for no sugar in the sauce). The meat also had some fruit – figs I think – on top it, & I ate one by mistake. The rest of the meal, I was really careful: nothing to drink but water & coffee (w/cream) & no dessert or bread, naturally! Still, the next day – Nothing on the sticks – no color, not even Trace! This NEVER happened to me that NOTHIG would register on the sticks. I did panic, I have to admit. I thought to myself: just that one little slip – sauce w/some sugar & a fig – and that’s enough to throw me out of ketosis? I mean, I’ve ordered ribs from Chinese restaurants, w/o the sauce, but I know even the ribs have Some sugar in them. (I don’t do this a Lot, though). However, the day after my steak meal, the stick registered very dark (I only do the sticks once a day). So, I don’t know – maybe for that one time, recently, where the stick showed nothing, the sauce on that steak might have been much sweeter than I realized. Also – how do you think coffee affects people? I’ve had a tough time of it, switching to decaf, but I did it – but now caf is creeping back in (1/2 caf/1/2 decaf coffee) which I have w/Heavy cream, only. Yet Gary Taubes, who was nice enough to respond to an email of mine, told me that the heavy cream might be problematical for me, which confused me, as Heavy Cream is mostly fat, no? I also stopped all diet soda – but alas, sometimes, I will have a bit of diet soda. Michael, I’m not doing this diet Perfectly. I try to stick to ONLY ketogenic food & I think I’m pretty good to Extremely good at that – but for instance, sometimes I will eat hot dogs or other un-organic meat, due to my budget & my energy level, (as I just want to nuke something, not actually cook). After over a year, my energy, while improved, is still low. I really Like this way of eating, though. I think for me, this is not going to be as easy as it is for others, but I also have to realize that my health has been very compromised to begin with, so I’m sticking w/this diet. Love your blog! Sincerely,
Zell
Wow! Zell, you’re making me blush with your compliments. Thanks for sharing such kind words.
Unfortunately, I can understand the apprehension you expressed that you might be called “stupid” or “confrontational” by questioning something. This is an issue I see a lot of places, and it rather infuriates me. I’m acutely aware of how much I don’t know, and always try to frame my opinions in terms of the science that I have available to me…with the painful realization that I’ve not read everything, nor am I an expert in this domain. Also, science can change: what we think we know today might be changed completely tomorrow. So if you see me being a sanctimonious jerk about anything I say, please call me on it. There’s not a lot of it in the low-carb community, but even a little is far too much.
Now, moving on…
From your comment, it sounds like you got the shaft with that steak. That’s unfortunate, but we’ve all been there at one point or another. There’s even a rumor out there that Chili’s coats their steaks in starch before grilling. Apparently it helps it get that appetizing brown/seared look. In your case, it sounds as if the sauce/glaze/and adjunctive fruit were enough to kick you out of ketosis…or were they?
Here’s where it gets interesting (and understand, all of what follows is total speculation. I haven’t researched this type of scenario, so I’m literally just doing the thought experiment thing): It is entirely possible that you managed to stay in ketosis, but you were no longer producing enough excess ketones to spill over into your urine. Or, perhaps you stopped producing new ketones until you burned off the glucose you ingested + the ketones already in your serum. Or, you could have been knocked out of ketosis entirely. Here’s a case where it’s impossible to tell what happened by measuring your urine ketones alone. A negative reading on the ketostix only says that there are no excess ketones in your urine. You could still have ketones in your serum. Still, the very fact that the change in your ketostix introduces uncertainty as a result of a change in your food consumption may be of value, even if we don’t know if you were knocked out of ketosis or not. The very uncertainty of your readings can be enough reinforcement to be more careful next time. (I actually have a hard time typing “careful”, as I think it’s more important to get back on the horse than it is to beat yourself up for a slip up…but hopefully my bigger point comes through.) The fact that your ketostix read dark purple after a day wouldn’t surprise me either. If you did indeed knock yourself out of ketosis, maybe when you ran out of glucose, you overproduced ketones (especially acetoacetate) until your body returns to that homeostatic state where you were at before you got derailed. Ok, enough speculation on that topic. . . we have other topics to speculate about…
In regards to your coffee question: It’s actually one I’ve tried to avoid researching too much, because I really like my coffee, and I don’t want to give it up. I mean, I REALLY LIKE IT. Enough that I bought a real espresso machine. Granted, it wasn’t working when I bought it (which explains why I could afford such a luxury in the first place), but I spent a couple of weeks bringing it back to life again…just so that I could upgrade my coffee game at home.
Where am I going with this? Well, I’ve been drinking coffee heavily for a number of years, and during the 18 months I’ve been living a ketogenic lifestyle, it does’ t appear to have influenced my weight loss. Of course, there’s no way for me to determine this for sure, but I’m down 120lbs…which I’m happy with (even though I still have a long way yet to go). I should note, however, that I drink my coffee black. If I have an espresso, I may sweeten it with some stevia drops. If I have a latte, I’ll steam heavy cream instead of milk.
It’s that last part where my experience might intersect yours: I have learned that I can’t go overboard with my cream. While it does have less than 1 carb per serving, a serving is only 1 tablespoon…and THAT has 50 calories. Depending on how much cream you put in your coffee (or in my case, I use for my lattes), and how many cups of coffee (or lattes) we have per day, we could be taking in an enormous amount of calories and/or suffering from the deleterious effects of carb-creep. Those foods that read “0 carbs” on the label are typically fractional carbs (some value less than 1). If you are ingesting multiple servings, you can’t just assume that you’re still at zero carbs. Maybe that’s what Gary was getting at in his response, or maybe he was getting at the possibility to drastically over consume calories. Both could probably said to be legitimate concerns. (As an aside, I was glad to see you comment on how nice it was to hear back from Gary. I’ve traded a few emails with him as well, and found him to be extraordinarily nice and giving of his time and knowledge on every occasion.)
Since you mentioned diet soda, I found that I needed to give it up. My wife was always on my case about it because she thinks it’s a toxic soup, but that notwithstanding, I noticed on a number of occasions that if I stopped drinking Diet Pepsi (my soda of choice), my weight loss would progress. However, if I started drinking again (more than 1 per 1-2 days), my weight loss would slow and/or stall. There are a number of possible explanations for why this is (I’d like to cover some of them some day), but in the end, my wife’s argument that “it’s not real food”, and the fact that it didn’t seem to do good things for my weight loss, settled the matter for me. So, I switched to water. If I need it sweetened, I lightly sweeten it with Mio. Before I discovered Mio, I was using Crystal Light, which wound up stalling me as well. It turns out that variety I was using is cut with maltodextrin. Perhaps this is why it stalled me.
So I gave up diet soda and Crystal Light, but continue to drink coffee…I’m acutely aware of others who can drink diet soda all day long and suffer no ill effects from it. Same thing with Crystal Light. Some people who give up soda because they found, like I did, that it stalls them will tell people wh drink it that they “should stop because diet soda inhibits weight loss”.
I think this is clearly the wrong approach to take: people need to find out what works for them. Clearly there are people who can drink 4 liters of diet soda a day and not inhibit their weight loss. And there are also people who appear to suffer by consuming a can or two every 1-2 days. Confronted with this knowledge that different people respond differently to it, the best anyone should be telling you is that when it comes to soda, be aware that it hinders some people, and has no effect on others…and that you are going to have to figure out whether or not it hinders you. When people say, categorically, “it’s fine” or “it will slow your weight loss”, we start to get into trouble.
Of course, In addition to whether or not it inhibits weight loss, there are obviously a slew of other reasons why we might want to consider removing diet soda from our diet. I’m purposely avoiding that discussion because IMO, it gets back to the “food quality” issues that are not really the focus of your question nor our conversation.
As far as your comments about trying to make the best food choices possible given your budget, energy levels, etc… I think I’m in the same boat as you there: for this to work, it has to be a practical and sustainable component of your life. I can’t eat grass-fed beef every night. We’d go broke. It’s a treat for us. We try to make the best decisions we can make, day by day, and find a way of living that is sustainable and healthy for us in the long run. If that means you have a hotdog here and there, or cook something in your microwave now and again, so what? I’m certainly not sanctimonious or perfect enough to call you out on something like that. In fact, I think you’re speaking to a profound reality most of us will have to come to terms with: how do we make this work without unlimited budget, unlimited time or energy to prepare ideal foods in the kitchen, etc… I’ll take sustainable-and-healthy over ideal-but-temporary any day.
Lastly, keep up your good work, Zell! I’m also coming from a position where my health was significantly damaged before starting this way of living. You and I have that in common. No going back! 😛
-Michael
Michael –
you appear to know so much about ketosis and the diet related to that it makes me wonder why you still count such archaic currency such as ‘calories’.
Are you sure you should continue this? Do you still believe a calorie of Stevia and a calorie of fresh fruit or cream have anything in common?
To tell you the truth, you could drain your coffee with fresh cream and still wouldn’t suffer from obesity ever.
Get back to the roots and reconsider your own writing and you will soon understand that you got misled when it comes to counting ‘calories’.
All the best for this journey,
Götz
You’re not wrong that a calorie of one food will affect your body differently than a calorie of another food, but if you think you can eat as much fresh whole food as you want and you’ll never get fat. it’s simply not true. Plenty of people have recorded weight gains on a whole foods diet, and while a bag of fresh cherries might not hit you in the exact same way as its carb equivalent in powdered sugar, it’ll still spike your blood sugar, kick you out of ketosis and give you cravings for even more carbs. The idea that “natural” things are across-the-board better than “unnatural” ones is the naturalistic fallacy, and besides that, cream doesn’t exist in nature any more than Stevia does. They’re both made by taking something natural and putting it through a human-invented artificial process. Neither was consumed by human beings for the vast majority of human evolution. Human beings have been consuming dairy for less than ten thousand years (which is nothing on an evolutionary scale), and even then only in specific areas of the world, which is why lactose intolerance is still so widespread.
I think you are less likely to get fat on a cream-only diet than a powdered-sugar-only diet, but not because one is more natural than the other. Honey is a very natural food and string cheese is highly unnatural but it’s the honey that will make you fat.
(As an aside, people on Keto should try to steer clear of any Stevia that has calories, because those calories come from additives and fillers that are pure carbs, such as maltodextrin, a starch used in powdered stevia. Pure stevia extract does not contain any calories.)
Do you know what makes me crazy? Is that people who have that “simple” answer for people who have a diease (obesity) will glady give it to them BUT…..BUY THE BOOK FIRST!!!
“But before I go there, let me urge you to just buy The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living, and read pages 164-165. Phinney and Volek have the best description of this that has probably ever been written, and you should really just read it from them.”
WHY COULD YOU SIMPLY GIVE IT TO THOSE WHO ARE SEARCHING FOR THESE ANSWERS??
Too much protein can also kick you out of ketosis (you can’t store protein, so if your system has more than it needs, it gets converted into glycogen…) That’s described in phinney & Volek’s book as well.
Michael,
Thanks for your great reply! Lots of info there, but I don’t feel overwhelmed.
I do feel worried now, about calories, but I’m not going to worry too much. I’m of the opinion that by doing a ketogenic diet, I don’t have to worry about calories. After all, the diet features tons of fat, which is very calorie dense. Still, I will try to be careful w/the cream. I really love cream in my coffee. I can do 1/2 caf/decaf as long as I get my cream, but I don’t need stevia or other sweeteners. However, when I use stevia for sweetening other things, I use sweet leaf stevia; it doesn’t have any maltodextrin or dextrose or anything like that added to it. As for diet soda, you’ve given me a good reason to stay away from it! I’ve been drinking seltzer water, sometimes sweetened w/some stevia. Given all my work, I really hope the calories won’t be such a big deal for me. Cream is such a luxury! I just wish I could have ice cream or find some low carb equivalent (but probably not the stuff I see in store freezers). I will also look into Mio; I’ve never heard of it. Well, Michael, you bring up a great point at the end of your response to me; doing this diet in the real world. In the real world, people might not be able to do the diet as perfectly as they’d like, but I think: as long as they stick to basics reasonably well, they are doing okay. I am a very easily stressed person, a person who constantly worries over things, so your kind response is very appreciated! Thanks for this blog. I’ve been checking it for a while. I’m very happy w/your most recent blog entry disproving Dean Ornish. I read that article of his & it stressed me out greatly; your rebuttal was very helpful! Well: Onward! I will not give up!
Thanks Zell!
When I started low carbing, I was bitten by stevia cut with maltodextrin and dextrose. I can’t comprehend why they would create a sucrose alternative and then do that.
Anyways, always check labels, right? After that experience with the powdered stevia we started with, we switched to SweetLeaf Clear Liquid Stevia as well. Good stuff & lasts a long time! I am, however, a bit disconcerted by the manufacturer’s extended range of flavored stevias…but not sure if it’s for good reason, or I’m projecting personal opinion too much.
You might want to try Swerve or xylitol.
Powdered forms of sweeteners over liquids are usually more cost effective.
Don’t worry about the cream in your coffee, Zel. In fact it is so helpful when it comes to buffer aggressive ingredients from roasting it.
After all, when you are on a low or non-carb scheme, cream is a mighty help for your hormonal system to promote your health, did you know that? Not only the HDL-cholesterol and the synthesis of your sex-hormones it ensures, also the fatty acids are a big help for any prolonged physical effort. If you want to read something about that feel free to contact me on my site!
Best,
creamdoc
PS: I think Gary Taubes urged caution to me re: cream because there is a nominal amount of carbs in cream. Gary Taubes doesn’t seem to care about people counting calories, but I have heard him say (& have read his writings on this) that for people extremely carb sensitive, even green, leafy vegetables can be problematical! Since I don’t drink too much coffee, I think I’m okay, but it just goes to show exactly what you wrote, Michael; we are all so different in terms of what might cause us trouble & what might not. I have concerns of not going off this way of eating, so if cream in my coffee helps me not feel deprived, I’ve got to factor that in, too. There is So Much Junk where I work! It’s really insane. Every day I have to refuse it & I Do, but I don’t want to start to feel deprived, because that’s often the death knell of any diet. Thankfully, my sugar cravings have gone Down, but I know that they could Easily be awakened, so your point about ketosis sticks keeping me on track also applies!
Thanks for the info….I was worried that my ketostix rarely shows pink colour, always beige, despite keeping carbs very low (under 20 per day)…..what are your thoughts on exercising, as I have seen a lot of high protein diets not recommend too much exercise…do you think this could be interfering with ketosis somehow?
Hi Linda!
Thanks for commenting! I remember having a completely distorted sense of what my ketostix should be as well. I see many people with the same anxiety (or worse), so I’m glad that you found this helpful.
In regards to exercising: it’s awesome. It’s truly great for health, and can really shape a body. As far as weight loss goes, it’s really not all that helpful and may actually slow things down (according to some of the research).
I spent the majority of my life thinking that, really, obesity is the result of laziness and I could get thin if I just exercised hard. It wasn’t until very recently that I actually started reading the research on it. It’s a fascinating domain to look in to, and I highly recommend you do so. I’ll add some links to the bottom of this comment, but the long and short of it is that you use diet to lose weight and look good at the office. Use exercise to look good in the bedroom. 😛
Here are the links:
I found your blog while searching for an answer to why my keto stix kept showing a negative result. Awesome writing btw!
I am fairly new to keto, but the last 2-3 weeks I have been eating less than 20 net carbs pr day, and drink A LOT of water.
I have also been drinking diet coke and Mio-flavored water – do you think this can affect the keto stix result? After my third day of cutting out everything drinkable but water, I am still getting negative keto stix. Should I just stop worrying and not measure anything with the stix?
I know that if differs and that some people can tolerate it while others have stalls, but can diet coke/Mio hinder the ketosis-level – or do they hinder weight loss in another way? Can I still lose weight even though I am not showing traces of ketones in my urine?
Thanks for the answer in advance
Sienna 🙂
Hi Sienna!
Sorry for the delay. I was on vacation!
At any rate, if I were in your shoes, I wouldn’t get too worked up over what the ketostix read. You’re still early into it, and it may take a few more days for you to start seeing anything on your ketostix.
As far as Mio and diet sodas and other artificially sweetened beverages: it seems like you’re just going to have to experiment. Based on anecdotal reports from the various low carb communities out there, it seems that some people can tolerate artificial sweeteners just fine. Others, it stalls out their weight loss or slows it down.
For What it’s worth, Andreas Eenfeldt has an interesting N=1 experiment showing what happened to his serum ketones after drinking a Diet Pepsi. It may be worth considering as you consider how to approach artificial sweeteners.
Yes. Absolutely. A negative reading on your ketosticks does not mean you won’t, can’t or are not losing weight. So don’t get down if you read negative. Just focus on keeping your carb consumption within the range you are using.
What is Mio?
All types of food extracts (similar to, say, vanilla extract, and available through specialty stores online) can be added to liquids for the flavor without the carbs.
My favorite liquid is sparkling water (not club soda) with a few drops of any extract and a spritz if desired of xylitol.
My friend and I both recently started eating low carb (atkins type) <20 carbs to lose weight. The strips have been helpful encouragement for us to continue on and interestingly forced him to admit he had a sandwich with bread one day! haha We are debating the sugar issue. Lots of items say that they have <1 sugar or 2, 3, or 4 sugars. Those are obviously less than cupcake icing, but where is the cutoff for staying in a weight loss state while eating lowcarb and frying bacon and eggs every day. I thought it was no sugar at all or it would throw you off but some people say as long as the carbs are 0 to super low, then don't worry about the small amounts of sugar that show up in salad dressing, lunch meat, etc.
It depends, I don’t worry about it if I’m eating the serving size on the package or close to that, but I think people caution about cream because it’s easy to drink much more than a serving’s worth if you are using it on keto as a kind of replacement for milk (e.g. in shakes, cooking etc). Your carton of whipping cream might say 0g carbs in each (tiny) serving but if you’re consuming a cup of it, that’s actually 7g of carbs, over a third of your carbs for the day if you’re aiming for 20g. That’s fine if you account for it but it’s really easy not to account for it when the carton still says “0 carbs”. It’s very easy to see that “0” and think it’s a real “0”, and not realize it’s some sneaky rounded number like “0.4”. A lot of companies actually pick the serving sizes on their packaging so that it the nutritional information looks more appealing.
Thanks so much for all this information. I have just started LCHF since Monday this week. Have some Ketostix. The colour of the sticks changed dramatically by Wednesday. No weight loss though. I am 62. I have been overweight all my life to varying degrees. Yo yo dieting all my life. I am fairly typical as am a child of the low fat low calorie mantra era – used weightwatchers slimming world lighter life always been successful losing chunks of weight only to pile it back on again time after time. I wanted to know what the ketone measuring meant so have stumbled across this wonderful site (how clever you are and I cannot thank you enough for posting this information for free). It seems you can be in ketosis and still not lose weight just that your body has moved to ketones to use for energy rather than glucose. I want to continue eating this way as I have a brother with Type 2 Diabetes. Although I have not been to the Doctors for confirmation I believe I am either pre-diabetic or actually got it. My weight is the highest it has ever been 17stone (238 pounds) I am very very typical of everything you read relating to metabolic syndrome. So am going to try and eat the LCHF way. It works. I have a sweet tooth. Having had no sugar at all and minimum carbs for only five days I feel better and so far no cravings. Although I have stood at the fridge door staring at my husbands chocolate. He is slim naturally so although eating and drinking anything he likes. I would say though he does not have a damaging relationship with food it has never been an issue. Whereas I have an awful relationship with food. He will eat to live – I on the other hand live to eat! But I am hoping it is not too late for me. At the moment I am just eating foods from the list of LCHF Diet Doctor’s website and trying to follow what is suggested on this forum and also Linda at About.com. I am going to use this Ketopia site to try to get my head around what and how much I can eat and lose weight. So far I believe whatever I am eating is just keeping the status quo, so suspect I have to at least write down exactly what carbs I am having and at least have a rough idea of type of food and keep an eye on the calories. It is difficult for me when it says have what you want, I am trying to treat this LCHF as being a cure for “food addiction” that food addiction that has cost me my weight spiralling out of control and ultimately my health. Thanks for listening just wanted to let everyone know here how much I for one appreciate all the time you have all taken to post your stories and all the fantastic information – which I find hard to take on board but believe I am just starting out on a road which I hope will result in losing weight, saying goodbye to sugar cravings, and keeping diabetes at bay. Thanks again. H X
Heather,
I was in exactly the same boat as you just six months ago. When the doctor named my weight problem along with high blood pressure and high cholesterol, metabolic syndrome, it put the fear of God unto me. He said ‘one more point on your fasting blood sugar and I will have to put diabetes on your chart’. He offered me a drug to bring my blood sugar down but I told him I wanted to try using nutrition as my medicine. I stopped all white foods and sugars of any kind that day. I had tried Atkins years before and remembered being in Ketosis. I bought a book on Keto and read it all in one evening, taking notes the second time through. I also bought Keto sticks and sure enough found I was in Ketosis. I won’t take the time and space to go through the Keto flu from eating some fruit but learned to be very strict with myself to avoid that baby again. I lost nine pounds the first month but then slowed way down on weight loss. I had blood work done and found my A1c had reversed from 6.5 to 5.6. Normal!! My cholesterol had dropped below 200 for the first time in 25 years. Everything is being healed that was so out of whack. I am thrilled with this way of living and will continue all my days. Wanted to encourage you and let you know this does take care of many health problems. My weight is slowly coming down. Not as fast as I thought but very satisfactorily. I believe Keto is working more rapidly on my insides so I am content to have a slow weight loss. Sometimes a pound a week or two. Sometimes none. I just decided if I keep on and now add in walking as often as possible, I will lose the weight. So very thankful to find this blog and that Michael is helping so many of us with his informational posts.
Thanks, I have been doing the < 20 carbs/day for 30 days now, down 19lbs and feel great! I bought some ketostix strips out of curiosity, every time I check, I get a neutral reading. Not real sure why, but you shed some light on the subject for me. The bottom line is I'm loosing weight and feel much better!
Thanks
Congratulations on your weight loss, Peter! That’s fantastic progress!
Keep us posted on your progress, and stay focused on your success (instead of the neutral readings). 🙂
-Michael
I know I shouldn’t worry about the stix not changing but they did change 2 times during the first 2 weeks and now negative in week 3. I track every morsel of food I eat and know I am under 5% carbs with around 60% fat and 35% protein.
Sample Day…
Meal #1
2 eggs with 2 egg whites
4 slices turkey bacon
2 tbsp cream cheese
Meal#2
small protein shake post workout
Meal#3
veggie egg white omelette
1 1/2 TBSP peanut butter
Meal#4
string cheese
2 TBSP cream cheese
Meal #5
4 oz protein
100 grams lettuce
2 TBSP dressing
Meal #6
2 eggs with 2 egg whites
4 slices turkey bacon
2 TBSP cream cheese
Macros around 1850 calories 26 carbs 128 fat 143 protein
**I am allergic to oil and butter which is why I don’t include that
Any thoughts?
Hi Jill!
Fantastic question. Well, a couple things come to mind:
First: the best way for you to determine what’s going on is to purchase a blood ketone meter and the corresponding test strips.
That’s not required, though…not pushing you in that direction. It’s just the fastest way to see what your actual serum ketones are.
The second thing to consider is this: excess protein will be converted into glucose. Some forms more readily so than others (from what I understand).
Looking over your macros, one thing I noticed is that 143g of protein could be overshooting the mark a bit.
Based on the rough estimate of .7g of protein per pound of lean body mass (Phinney and Volek recommend .6-1.0g/lb lean body mass), and your consumption of 143g/protein per day… your lean body mass would be 203lbs (please check my math). Seems high to me.
Before investing in a blood ketone meter, I’d use a protein calculator and try dialing back your protein a bit. You can continue to use the urine ketone test strips and see if they budge, or you can ignore them altogether and just go by the guidelines and see what your body does.
http://ketopia.com/the-art-and-science-of-low-carbohydrate-performance-phinney-and-volek/“>The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance for more information on protein macros and your way of eating. I found it to be very helpful.
Lastly, it’s possible that everything is fine (but check your protein numbers to be sure) and the reason you’re not seeing anything on the ketostix is because you are ketoadapted and just not producing enough to register on the ketostix (or register with the same intensity). Remember, after some time your body will dial back the number of ketones it produces. . . and this can result in fewer excess ketones in your urine.
Keep us posted on what you learn!
-Michael
You need more veggies my dear. That is not enough vegetables for your body to thrive and prevent disease
Richard and Carl and their guests have talked about reducing the number of meals per day to enhance the effect of reducing insulin levels and improving insulin resistance.
Jason Fung eloquently weighs in with info on YouTube and in his books The Diabetes Code and The Obesity Code about major reductions in numbers of feedings per day. It is important to achieve satiety with fats and then liver-driven gluconeogenesis soon thereafter providing your brain and muscle energy.
I cut out carbs and sugars since December 2012 and down 70 lbs, however, lately I have been obsessed with the color on the keto stix (testing multiples times a day), especially if my first reading only showed a trace of keytone. Crazy …I know. I too found if I have coconut oil it increases the color of the keto stix. I mainly want to ensure I stay in ketosis. However, I did slip up today…ate a little piece of cake and icing. One slip in 7 months.
I truly enjoyed reading everyone’s comments. It has helped me understand keto stix better. Thank you everyone. Hopefully I won’t continue to be so obsessed with the color on the stix. I doubt I stop testing completely at least now, but I won’t be so obsessed with it like I have been.
Deb,
No need to apologize. Keep your eye on the prize: you’re already 70lbs down. That’s amazing in and of itself!
-Michael
Hi there,
I have found this site pretty interesting so far, and I’m wondering if it can help me with some nagging questions.
First off, I have just started a low carb diet about 2 weeks ago. My daily carbs vary from 8-45. Should I be more consistent or keep it lower in general?
Secondly, I found that a small wheel of camembert cheese melted, with about a small handful of blueberries, tastes great and is low carbs. I’ve been having one everyday, Is this a bad idea?
I should note that I’m using the strips twice daily, and they are constantly changing between light pink and neutral. Also, my post weight range is consistently 4lbs less.
Thanks,
Tina
Hi Tina!
Thanks for the question!
First off, congratulations on starting a low carb diet! That can be an important milestone for many people.
As far as your daily carb intake: unfortunately, there’s no universally applicable guideline that is ideal for everyone. Some people report that as long as they stay below 75g/carbohydrate a day, weight loss continues. Others report that if they exceed 20g/carbs a day, they stall. Finding what works for you is key.
As far as consistency goes: again, I’d let the results be your guide. I tend to try to shoot for a consistent range, but that’s just me. If you’re seeing results doing what you’re doing, and you are comfortable with the results, keep on keeping on!
As far as your camembert and blueberries go: Can you share the carb counts with us? All things being equal and if it isn’t derailing or slowing your progress, then there’s likely little harm in it.
As my answers indicate, there’s a great deal of variation in Keto in regards to what works for some people, and what doesn’t work for others. Part of the beauty of the advice of keeping carbs below 20g a day is that it tends to be more universally applicable: if you do this, you’ll be in ketosis. However, not everyone needs to be that strict.
Hope this helps! Keep up the good work!
-Michael
Hi, I found you site very useful. I’ve started doing keto diet for a number of reasons. Although this is not new to me as I use it when competing (bodybuilding), I am 50 years old (63 kg) and have no energy, huge cravings and hormonal changes, so I though after trying all diets that are out there to give this one a go for a long period. I have noticed that with the years I’ve become more sugar sensitive. My question is regarding the nutrients. I worked them out on a calculator and this is what I came up with 120g protein, 110g fat, 5g carbs. I kept the carbs low because I saw no changes in the first week when they were at 20g. I only want to lose 2kg. I currently do heavy weight training 3 x week for 40 minutes, 2 interval HIT training cardio – 40 minutes and 9 x 30 minutes power walks. This might look a look however I do compete and this is already taking my previous training down by half. I desperately need to get some energy back in my life. I don’t do coffee, sweetners (they affect my blood sugar), dairy etc. I have done another week with the above allowances but still not change. The reason I read your article is because there is no ketones showing on the sticks and I now understand why. Thank you
Minda,
Thanks for your comment. I’m glad you found the article helpful!
-Michael
I am confused. Have been on the keto diet for 4 weeks strictly, and today went and bought the ketostix and it didn’t show any traces at all…..zilch!!!
So are you saying that if one is in ketosis then you will get a change in colour to the pinks instead of remaining beige?? Please help. I am having a hard time getting my head around this 🙁
Hi Vlasia!
Thanks for your comment!
The first thing to do is, don’t panic! 😛
OK, so here’s the deal… If ketostix are not showing ketones, either of the following could explain it:
Unfortunately, there is no way with ketostix to determine which of the above is at play. If I were in your shoes, I’d rule out carb creep. Measure everything for a few days, and keep your carb intake to less than 20g/day. At that level, you will be in ketosis (after a few days).
You might also try taking a tablespoon of coconut oil and then measuring (hours later). Many people report that doing this invariably turns their ketostix purple. I’m suggesting it ONLY to test that your batch of ketostix isn’t bad. (You could also try another batch).
I hope this helps you sort through what’s going on? Remember: When in doubt, Keto on…
-Michael
So you are really indicating that ketones are a necessary result from going without carbs?
Let me tell you that I have completely different findings and results, Michael. And this is not for being conflictive or rude, just for the fact of it.
There i also quite a large number of athletes, patients and normal people who did my diet and are ketone-free (and stay there, no matter whether they eat carbs, sweets or just protein and fat. I figure the key lies in the kind of fat you use and get used to during the process of getting rid of carb metabolism as the only source of energy. Best, Götz HEINE
I looked up your diet, based on your English page it’s a diet of up to 1L cream per day and water and nothing else for 7-14 days, and then they start to ramp off and eat their regular foods again? There’s no point in that diet that involves going without carbs. 1L HWC has 30g carbs. That is enough for some but not all people to get into ketosis. The timeline of your diet also sounds like many people “adapt” and stop producing ketones around the same time that they start reintroducing their regular foods (ie more carbs), in which case it’s expected they would fall out of ketosis. Without an actual study or food diary, I would guess that if people are losing weight, it’s because they’re consuming less than 700 calories a day during the cream-only portion, and eating so little during that time may curb the appetite for some time after that.
Very helpful overview of ketones. Thanks!
I ahve a couple of questions. When everyone speaks of 20 g of carbs is that net carbs or carbs in general? Also, I have heard that caffeine can held or hinder weight loss. Any comment?
Thanks so much for your article on ketosis. It helped clear up some things and help me let go of the obsession to check all the time.
Hi Lynn!
Thanks for stopping in! These are great questions!
First off, your question about carbs:
That’s net carbs (which means total carb content, minus the fiber).
And here we get into some trickier territory worthy of a post with citations. Until I have the time for that (or someone else takes up the cause), you’re going to have to take the off the cuff response:
While caffeine is non-caloric, it may have a role in weight regulation for some people…especially if the hormone/insulin theory of obesity is to be believed. Check out this research to get started: Caffeinated coffee consumption impairs blood glucose homeostasis in response to high and low glycemic index meals in healthy men. In this research, the authors conclude that “The ingestion of [coffee] with either a high or low GI meal significantly impairs acute blood glucose management and insulin sensitivity compared with ingestion of [decaf coffee].”
With that said, many people report no negative effects of coffee consumption while dieting. Others clearly have issues with it and learn to avoid it.
For what it’s worth, I work with a gentleman with an insulin pump. One day in the cafe we were making small talk while I was making my coffee. Someone asked him why he doesn’t drink coffee. His response: “I can’t,” he said, lifting up his shirt and revealing the insulin pump attached to his belt. “I’m diabetic. When I drink coffee, my sugar spikes and my insulin pump goes crazy…”
Yes, he was talking about black coffee unadulterated by cream, sugar, milk, etc…
Thanks so much for your insightful responses.
you can find the strips at $30 for 10, which is a bit cheaper I guess
Again Michael,
this is a very interesting blog for someone who has been working with metabolic switches for more than a decade in Germany. Thank you for your work.
However, let me again emphasize on the fact that we found out that after a very short time of dieting the way I recommend it there is no traces of ketones detectable in any of my patients, athletes and ‘normal’ people.
Also, there is no need to stay carb-, let alone sugar-free to maintain a lean and healthy body once you have switched your metabolism to converting fat into energy. Its probably because our systems use the ketones straight away, so they don’t even get into the outer bloodstream, let alone lungs, kidneys and urine.
Best,
Götz Heine
alternative practitioner/naturopath
Munich, Germany
Thank you Dr. Heine!
I appreciate your willingness to be so generous of your time and wisdom on so many of these posts.
Perhaps you can share with us the details of your dietary protocol and how you’re measuring (or not) ketones in your patients.
Anything else that would inform the discussion is, of course, welcome.
-Michael
Just for healthy people and athletes as a quick shot for the moment, Michael:
The general recipe is switch to fat burning with a diet consisting of whipped cream (no additives!) for like 7 to 10 days. Exercise daily up to one hour (athletes more of course). Drink plain water or herbal tea, (no black or green, no coffee) as much as you like (min. 1 liter/day).
Monitor your ketones if you want but is n o t essential as you will smell and taste it anyway until they will be gone ;-). Note that some people need longer to get clear of ketones as a sign that their metabolism isn’t already fully adapted to the art of burning fat, human fat as you find it in cream only.*) Understand that everything else (other fats, let alone oils!) is an extra load to a clean efficient metabolism otherwise you could feed it to your babies as well, couldn’t you?
Addition: For most people a liver flush with Epsom Salt prior to the diet is helpful to clean intestines and bile.
*) So you might as well give it another go some months from when you went on the first switch, can’t you?
Best,
Götz
HWC does not contain human fats and you absolutely should not feed it to a nursing baby. It does not have the same mix of nutrients, they cannot digest it properly and it can cause them kidney damage. Even if cow milk was good for babies, that would not mean much for an adult human digestive system. Evolutionarily-speaking, humans and other mammals are “built” to drink their own species’ milk as babies only, then weaning off onto some mix of plants, animal meats and eggs (depending on whether it’s an herbivore, carnivore or omnivore). Our ancient ancestors didn’t eat whipped cream any more than they ate Twinkies.
I’m still unclear on this part.
How are you measuring ketone production, and what is the dietary regimen that results in lack of ketone production.
Regards,
Michael
Hello Michael,
first of all please note that in the tems of English speaking countries I’m a naturopath, an alternative practitioner, not a doctor.
To refer to your question let me confirm that by no means I am a scientist who can afford running extended research on where the remnants of fat metabolism go to.
Both, urine and serum protocol can be used to measure ketones and will monitor the dieter’s success or during the diet already or afterwards, depending on the person’s initial state of health.*)
The fact that the better they respond the less ketones can be traced in neither of the tissues named above urges me to claim that they, depending on the way the body got introduced to the art of burning fat (and this is where the diet I have been promoting for more than a decade kicks in) get metabolised to CO2 and H2O.
Therefore, and in my humble opinion, the Ketogenic Diet is a myth rather than a desirable goal to aim at because ketosis is a metabolic state not worth to go for let alone to stay in. For all those who want to shift away from carb overload it is however a neccessary phase to travel t h r o u g h to improve their state of health.
*) This is why sometimes endurance athletes and children of families who were used to continuous physical work report that even when they went on the Ketogenic Diet you promote couldn’t trace ketones at all (scroll back to Vlasia’s post on October 24, 2013 at 2:38 ). They might experience a light initial nausea followed by an adaptation free of any symptomes and remain there). All other athletes, ‘workers’ and patients pass through a rough state of overcoming their carb addicition. When on the diet I prescribe a general figure is 2-5 days within the 10 day diet until this ketone-free state is reached.
Some people who need longer adaptation are better off to stop the diet after 7 days, recover and undertake a second attempt later in order to become ketone-free.
Understand that the primary source of energy from fat is the c r e a m i n
m o t h e r ‘s/a mammal’s milk, no oils let alone raw or fried fatty tissue. Therefore and provided it has no other option, our metabolism remembers swiftly and will adapt quite easily to this well-known source of energy. Once re-introduced to the Art of Burning Cream (you may call it ‘fat’ but please accept my strong diapproval for obvious reasons, Michael) it will keep up this virtue for a long, a very long time. Now carbs can be added or cut out – no problem, as our body will notably tell us when it had enough.
Yes, I understand that you are not a medical doctor. Still, I referred to you as “doctor” as a courtesy. I think it is clear you are not an MD.
So, your patients who show now ketone production after a week…are you using both approaches to determine this? Or are you just reminding us that these two methods can be used?
I’m not sure I follow your logic here, but I appreciate you taking the time to share your opinion with us.
Regards,
-Michael
So say ‘Creamdoc’ Michael ;-).
I used to execute both protocolls long time ago. Urine is quite simple, but like in the U.S. serum screening was hideously expensive. Back in those days I even
carried around a big photometer to stage race events, training camps a.s.f. to screen Hb, Fe, Chol, Uric Acid and other parameters as they seemed to be of more significance to me.
In my time off I used to work as a direcotr sports, masseur and race mechanic.
Ketosis you could detect easily by the smell of your athlete’s breath and sweat, so very soon I skipped this from the list of chemicals to carry around.
B.t.w., if once you entered a team bus full of athletes coming back from a race you could smell testosterone, adrenaline and ketones, of course.
As there is no reason to hide anything, no frills, no tricks feel invited to take a free course in Cream Dieting by getting in touch with me via info@biomac.biz , Michael.
I can pretty much till by the “smell” of my urine when my body is excreting ketones. I’ve used the sticks in the past but they were just for newbie reassurance. One whiff and I’m good to go these days.
Hi Michael
Thank you for a very interesting blog. I am an amateur cyclist from Ireland I have had the advantage and pleasure of working with Götz Heine during a world cup ultra endurance cycling event (Race around Ireland) Which is 1350 miles in 132 hours. I completed his cream diet and adapted to burning fat within two weeks. Body composition Measurements were taken before and after 6 weeks using bod pod. Body fat had been reduced from 12.5 % to 7.5% and no loss of power. For the first time in my life I lost any interest in carb heavy food. However I was able then at that point to take any food I choose. As an comparative experiment I have also followed a ketogenic diet for six months keeping within 0.5-3 mmol. My conclusion was I lost power during anerobic efforts as measured by SRM. I think that once you have adapted to burning fat as a primary fuel which I did with the cream diet then it just becomes a question of carbohydrate timing.
Regards
Jim Doyle
G’day Michael,
thought provoking stuff. As with Jim Doyle, I’ve followed Gotz Heine’s cream diet method out of curiosity. I adapted completely to burning fats after 6 days and lost 7 kg in that time. To make the point about ketosis that I believe Gotz is trying to make, I was in ketosis for 1 day only of the 6 days it took my body to ‘convert’ and subsequently completed a hilly 200 km bike ride with a group of fit cyclists while consuming 2 dried figs only during the 7.5 hour hard ride.
I’m glad that you are attempting to help people but it is not necessary to stay in ketosis as you have outlined.
Spoke to Steve Hogg from Australia the other day. He’s both, a client who also became a friend of mine, Michael.
He follows your blog and wanted to share his experience with your readers, but for some reason didn’t
get his reply through to you. So I copied it and paste it here:
“G’day Michael,
thought provoking stuff. As with Jim Doyle, I’ve followed Götz Heine’s Cream Diet method out of curiosity. I adapted completely to burning fats after 6 days and lost 7kg in that time. To make that point about ketosis that I believe Götz is trying to make, I was in ketosis for one day only of the 6 days it took my body to ‚convert’ and subsequently completed a hilly 200 km bike ride with a group of fit cyclists while consuming 2 dried figs only during the 7.5 hour hard ride.
I’m glad that you are attempting to help people but it is not necessary to stay in ketosis as you have outlined.”
Indeed!
As you can imagine, we get a lot of people trying to spam the comments here, manipulate backlinks etc… and it appears that Steve’s comments and yours are now considered spam and getting trapped in the SPAM folder upon submission.
Regardless, I’d like to see the conversation move from repeating “it is not necessary to stay in ketosis” to a more helpful discussion of the science that informs Mr. Heine’s approach.
Servus Michael,
following your request formore detailed information on how to come ketone-free when living on a fat-diet I summarized my findings for those speaking English at http://www.biomac.biz/cream-diet/ .
Further questions are answered on http://www.biomac.biz/faq-concerning-creamdiet/ .
Hope this answers your questions. If anything remains unsolved don’t hesitate to
contact me.
via info@biomac.biz ..
If man had waited for science to develop the wheel, we’d still walk. If medicine had chosen the right way,
a simple cold wouldn’t exist any more.
Cut to the chase, Michael, if babies could choose between mother’s milk and scientifically designed powder what would you consider to be better for them? Science describes nature, however it still far from creating it. In the meantime consider Ketosis as a hurdle in man’s way back to a physiologically clean energy production, nothing more and nothing less. The perfect man breaks down fat as if he’d metabolise carbs. And this is good as he has so much bigger reserves of it stored in his body.
Give me some time and the German version of how to perform the switch will be brought to the English speaking world.
Sometimes the morning gives false positive due to pooling of ketones overnight.
It’s not true that the perfect human body would break down its own body fat as easily as it breaks down consumed carbs. Body fat is supposed to be long-term storage of energy for lean times, and we need a little bit of fat on our bodies to prevent a variety of health problems. If human fat melted away as fast as we packed it on, our “perfect” ancestors would have starved after the first snowfall in winter.
Science does not describe the state of nature perfectly, it can only be an ever-evolving set of models that hopefully get closer to the truth over time. But at least it has mechanisms to test its models, and reject the ones that don’t make sense.
Hi I’ve never have used ketone stix before so just want to know when do you do the test like do I do it first thing in the morning or evening and do you do it before you eat and drink or after to get best results ?
shielry
Sometimes the morning gives false positive due to pooling of ketones overnight.
Love this article and blog. Can you give me your advice on TOO much protein, and how that can knock you out (because it is turned into glycogen if it cannot be used/stored)? Is this true?
Please help! I have been below 20 grams for four weeks and not lost a pound. I went down to 500 calories on day and gained a pound. I eat two eggs in the morning, cheese or two bratwurst for lunch, a four by six inch piece of meat for dinner. Diet coke and tea. This is beyond depressing.
Chantal. You need to look at your detox capabilities. Possibly not providing nutrients to enable phase 1 & 2 liver detoxification to occur and therefore not moving toxins/fat. Also could be in starvation mode. Ditch the diet coke in favour of water & herbal teas.
Hello! something I did not understand ….I was in Paris for 2 weeks, my ketosticks were ALWAYS dark purple …I ate lots of cheese and some chicken and more cheese …;-0 , after these 2 weeks my jeans were so tight and I had put on weight ..;-( I was thinking that as long as your ketosticks were purple you were losing weight ….
is it that the so much cheese took me over too much protein?? Merci!
Hi, I loved reading your comments and will no longer stress so much over ketosticks. Maybe you can help me with another question though? I have been on Atkins for 2 weeks now, no more than 20 net carbs per day and have not lost any weight 🙁 I am bloated and wondering if this could be the cause? Not constipated but feel like I should be “moving” more! I have added 3 teaspoons of Metamucil but no better yet? Drinking 2 litres of water a day. Thanks for any suggestions 🙂
Hi, I have been following the Ideal Protein diet to a T now for the past 12 days. I felt like I went into Ketosis after the first 24 hours according to my symptoms. I thought at this point I might pick up Kitostix more out of curiosity than anything else. I tested my urine several times last evening and did not get any type of reading. After reading the information here, I have decided that I am not going to stress over that as my body must be adjusted to such low carbs and the difference in my clothes is more concrete than what a little stick says. Comfort comments are welcome!! thanks
I am also doing IP..not showing any ketones in my urine. My coach said if I am doing the diet correctly, I will not have ketones?? That confused the heck out of me! How can it say it uses ketosis to lose wt if no ketones? I never did get a clear answer.
I’ve been on a low carb/high fat diet for 6 weeks now and have been using Ketostix to monitor what I thought were BHBs. The interesting note is that now, suddenly, the reagent strips are deeply purple. I’d like to also note that I drink a ton of water, so dehydration doesn’t seem a plausible cause for the change in color. What does it mean if I am suddenly dumping a higher amount of acetoacetate in my urine?
When you say keeping carbs under 20 to guarantee ketosis, are you referring to 20 net carbs or total carbs?
Hi Ashleigh,
Excellent question!
I was referring to net carbs. I’ll make that clear in the post to avoid confusion.
-Michael
I’m only 5 weeks in to LC/HF but I’m down 22lbs, feeling better and once I hit the 3 week point, unless I’m dehydrated, my stix always come up in the light pink 15 range, even when I hit 50 carbs instead of 20 and I still drop weight. (though those extra carbs normally come from fruit instead of junk food) My roommate though tests either nothing at all or dark purple and is losing at a much slower rate than I am (she’s down 10lbs in 5 weeks) and if she goes over 20 at all begins to feel bad physically in less than 24 hours. I think it’s different for each of us. I’d LOVE to have the meter, as a 42 year old woman trying to drop over 200lbs (yes really, I looked at the scale at my drs last time and I was 383 and I am short so I was petrified at the number and I HAVE to fix this) but right now my moblity is limited so my funds are limited and I find the pale pink keto stix reassuring, even if I know logically it’s not the most accurate choice. I do love this post though and agree with the ‘you know it’s working because you can feel it’ vibe. I’ve loved how quickly I’ve learned to read my bodies signs to stop eating or not eat as opposed to constant gnawing hunger.
on low carb diet recently again as have insulin resistance and carbs drive up my cholesterol/triglycerides/LDL..years ago had super result changes in the above after going on atkins for 6 weeks….also using a plant sterol cholesterol supplement that friends have had tremendous results with for their high chol. Don’t want to go on statins, was on them and had a severe gut reaction which lasted about 8 months to get balanced again. Dr. working with me on this, will be tested after 8 weeks. anyone else used the low carb approach to lower cholesterol?
Yes, Carol. Please read my post above.
Thelma
Wondering if anyone can give me some advice. I started the Ideal Protein diet last summer and lost about 20 pounds (5’3 started at 143 and went to around 124 lbs). I’ve been maintaining for about a year now but recently gained some weight back and I am now at 130. I tried doing my own “version” of Phase I ideal Protein with real foods and Quest bars as the treat but the scale literally won’t budge. I exercise frequently but always add 100 extra calories and 20 grams of protein when I exercise.
I’m wondering if a ketogenic diet will help me lose this extra weight. In comparison I just seems like SO much fat and more calories than I’m used to when dieting but it seems as though many people have had success and it could fit my lifestyle more since I enjoy exercising. Thoughts?
Hi Bridget!
First off, congratulations on your success so far. That’s a great start, and while you have regained some, please keep your eyes on the prize. You’ve still made progress.
As far as whether or not a ketogenic diet can help: the only guaranteed way to know for sure is to try it. With that said, the keto diet communities are full of IP ex-pats.
The Ketogenic diet is high fat, moderate protein and low carb. It’s a healthy way of eating and an effective means of weight loss for many people. You might also consider that you don’t have to buy special branded (and expensive) foods in order to succeed with it. Additionally, nobody is making a profit off your weight loss… well, perhaps the clothing manufacturers will, but it’s not a high-cost franchise program (like some you may be familiar with).
With that said, I recommend starting with some food for your mind before you engage on a new diet. There are two book that are indispensable: Gary Taubes’, Why We Get Fat and Phinney and Volek’s, The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living. The Taubes book is a great resource that puts obesity and weight gain in the historical context of a changing dietary composition of macronutrients. It’s an easy and insightful read with profound implications to our diets. The Phinney and Volek book is the “How To” resource to get you started with an effective ketogenic diet. You should be able to get both through your library system if you don’t want to buy them.
Sound reasonable?
I have 7 to 8 pounds to lose (my jeans are tight (I do not weigh myself …makes me crazy) … don’t lose with LCHF …I never had a straight answer… do you have to count calories to lose on LCHF …my keto where always very dark (maybe I did not drink enough H2O )…. should i lose on lots of bacon + chicken 10 – 12 onces + 6 eggs + home made mayo (no carbs at all) in an average day ??? Merci, Chantal
I have also been having the same problems and was searching through and read your questions and was hoping for a reply as I am sure you were as well. Hopefully with me leaving this reply to yours someone will answer. I have been keto for 4 weeks now hitting my daily macros and tracking religiously. My Ketostix are always dark. I can’t tell if they are between the second to last color and the one before or the last and second to last. Is this dangerous? Like Ketoacidosis? I know I feel much better and lost some weight at first. I’m not trying to lose a lot. I was 135 and now at 122. I want to be around 115. I feel better at that weight and better about the way I look around that weight normally. I can’t tell if I’m fat adapted. I feel like I may have keto breath sometimes and at others I don’t. My urine doesn’t smell. I try to drink water as much as possible but I hate it lol. I have been using Mio to make it taste better. I’m just wondering when I will be keto adapted and gain all these great things you hear about. I am working out and doing resistance training at a gym 3-6 times a week. And maybe this is the reason for little weight loss lately? Please help me and Chantal! Thanks!
Hello-Michael
I stumbled across your blog and must say it is the least confusing of the blogs concerning the Keto Lifestyle- I am a cyclist and have been flirting with the low HFLC off and on for over a year- I did the Paleo thing and lost about 20 lbs, which was great- However, I am on fire to develop more discipline and stick to a “ME” plan- Beer is my weakness!!! I am ordering the book suggested and will give it a try- Can you offer any advise to a newbie and where would I find a monthly meal plan to really get me going? I have also heard about MCT oil? Is this a beneficial product? Thanks and look forward to hearing from you soon 🙂
Gregory in Woodstock-Ga
Hi Gregory!
Thanks for the compliment! I, and all the other contributors, are delighted you’ve found this a useful resource for you!
As far as a meal plan, well, most of the books should have one…but you’re going to have to count carbs and give up beer.
The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living is a fantastic resource if you are new to this way of health. But given that you are also an athlete, I’d recommend you also pick up The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance. Phinney and Volek know their stuff, and this is an excellent companion work to their primary treatise on the subject.
And lastly, I’d encourage you to check out Shelley Schlender’s site and interviews with Volek and Phinney. Many are geared towards athletic performance and low carbohydrate way of eating. This should take you to a bunch of relevant search results, but make sure to check out the rest of the site. Good things abound.
And MCT Oil… that keeps coming up and up and up. Medium Chain Triglycerides are readily converted into energy, and can be used as part of an athletic training or performance regime. They are also popular among low-carb, non athletes for the way in which they often turn ketostix a deep purple. (The only benefit I see here is the confidence boost.)
So yes, there may be a place for MCT Oils in your training regime…but I’d really recommend that you feed the mind first. Understand what this way of eating entails, and how it can it relates to your athleticism, before jumping on with all the extras. In fact, if you are looking for helpful supplements, I’d recommend .
So there you have it. I hope this is a helpful starting point. You’re really doing a great thing, but it’s well worth starting with the fundamentals.
Please check in again and let us know how it’s going. Your success is inspiration to many…
Michael, first you said that eventually AcAc will be converted to BHB. Then you had said that when serum levels of AcAc fall that BHB is converted to AcAc. So in the end, shouldn’t the ratios remain about the same?
I started a low carb diet 7 weeks ago and have lost about 16lbs so only have around another 14lbs to lose. I went to Greece last week and had a little more wine than I should and a couple of ice creams because of the heat . Am back on target now interestingly I bought Keto sticks for first time today reading was pale pink guess I should be happy with that have enjoyed reading people’s comments will keep it up long term.
Does the body building product C4 affect getting to the induction phase
I hope this thread continues, since I just found it. Thanks
Well for me you clear this up, as you say (makes sence) either you are eating too many of the wrong foods. And comming out of ketosis, or you are doing just great loosing the weight, and in ketosis, with the same reading for both, being ignorant of the fact that the reading does get lighter as you go on, helps me to realise your conclusion that you may be just wasting your money on ketosticks, for the above mentioned. I think now I have a grasp of it, won’t use them anymore, but for my fellow LCHF devotees, if it reasures you, it’s all good.
What do you think of the breathalyzer method for measuring ketones is it worth it?
I love sweets…I love chocolates… when I am alone…I chew up candy, cookies..all I want…but it discard them in the kitchen sink…and what’s left in my mouth..I swallow…But all that chewing and munipilating the control of not swallowing… I never crave sweets on this low carb diet. Gross? Some say yes…but….what’s wrong with it if done in private? (O: I HAVE LOST 40 POUNDS IN 4 MONTHS! 2x sweaters…Now Large!
Hi, I have been on keto diet for the past 3 weeks. I have lost 5lbs. I came to the diet via a circuitous route, in that I had read the Wheat belly book and found most of it fascinating. My daughter has a very def gluten intolerance, and I have always felt heavy and stodgy after pizza etc. My main issue is – osteoarthritis. From the sites I have read, I hear that sugar creates inflammation, and osteoarthritis mostly caused by inflammation. Why isn’t there any reference to it, anywhere I’ve looked. I am enjoying keto way of eating, but am worried. About the amount of dairy I’m eating because of its historic connection to inflammation. Thank you for providing the opportunity for me to ask about these concerns. I have been off coffee for years, but am now having one or two with full cream, and I’m addicted!!!! Have to watch it. I have also been using the ketostixand and find they fluctuate a lot, from deep purple to pale. I presume that the lighter the colour the better??? Thanks again to you Michael, and all contributors.
Hi, I have been on a LCHP diet for 8 days and have a couple questions.I have read many of the above postings and do not yet see the answers. I have been following IP Phase 1 diet for 8 days and do not see any indications of ketosis. I used ketostix last night and this morning, and it only indicates “Trace” amounts of ketones in my urine. Do you know how long it takes for ketosis to “kick in” for the average dieter? Is it possible to be in ketosis but not have any detectable physical indications? I drink coffee with no additives every day, and I do not cheat on the diet. Is there anything else that can keep you from being in ketosis? I see a few mentions of “starvation mode”, but I don’t know what that is or if it is something that kicks you out of ketosis? Does stress have any effect? I know I shouldn’t worry, but I am new to this and I would just feel a lot better if I could have some way of knowing initially that I am in ketosis and if not, what I can do about it. I would really appreciate your thoughts.
Jane I have been on LCHF for 10 weeks, and not so simple, because everyone is different, you might be really over weight and your fat might have been their a long time, and will take time to shift.
Like me you might be insulin resistant, another whole new ball game. You might be eating too much protein, or carbs. you could be over excersising or not enough. I myself have only lost a kilo (2.2pounds) in 10 weeks and am constantly looking at what I am putting in my mouth, I always fast from 8pm to 12 midday. to get the Blood sugars down. when it comes down to it, it is what calories you are taking in, to what you are burning off, and fat is very calorie dence, so it does not take much to over do it. Keep tweaking your food, and have patience. Hope this helps.
The color doesn’t matter unless you get no result at all, in which case it still might not matter (for the reasons in the article). Trace result is still a result, so you’re in ketosis. You can do things to manipulate the color (drinking less water can make your result darker) but this won’t actually improve your weight loss. Drinking lots of water is good.
Hello, interesting blog. Thanks for all the info, and best wishes to all who are trying to eat healthier! I wonder if someone can answer a question I have about the ketostix. I have been getting some readings where the colour was quite saturated, whether it was pink or purple, it was a very deep, rich colour. Some days however, the colour is really weak. It still seems to be pink or purple, but it’s quite faded. Why does that happen? Is it a problem? Thank you!
Hi Anne!
That’s a great question. Unfortunately, I only have a couple theries…not a definitive answer. First off, I’ve seen (what I assume is) the same thing on occasion. While this might all be speculation, it’s how I’ve explained it away to myself. 😛
First Explanation
The amount of reactive agent (sodium nitroprusside) on the blotter pad of the ketostix is not always consistent. When there is more of it present, there is more available to react to the acetoacetate present in your urine. This results in a deeper “saturation”. When there is less present, I still see the various graduations of color, but it is fainter/less “saturated”.
Second Explanation
The reactive agent on the ketostick (sodium nitroprusside) is sensitive to stuff. It becomes less sensitive over time, exposure to light, humidity, air, gravity and certain types of politics. Sometimes I have used ketostix and the change on the pad seems muted. I can still make out the colors, but they are much less intense.
As I said, I’ve experienced this a number of times. It seems like much less frequently using the name brand Bayer ketostix (and others) purchased from the pharmacy , and more frequently when I purchase cheaper ketostix online at a discount. For my uses, the variability is not a problem…but if you’re concerned about what you are seeing, you might want to compare with a recently manufactured lot purchased from your local pharmacist. (Your pharmacist may be able to give you an estimate of how long the inventory has been sitting on the shelf, etc…)
Anyways, great questions. That’s how I’ve explained it when I’ve run into it. What do you think? Anyone have a better explanation of what’s happening?
Hi! Loving the blog – very insightful. Just curious on why my ketostix show medium/ dark purple in the morning post-breakfast and nothing at all at bedtime? I’m in week 2 of my diet and am under 20 carbs/ day – lost about 6 pounds so far and feel good but not sure why my results are so varied? Th !
Hi Michael
Firstly I would just like to say how refreshing and impressive this blog is and your total unbiased and I formative comments/outlooks are.
I’m a Ironman athlete currently training and completing in the ironman triathlon distance and ultra marathons and decided last November to switch to the LCHF diet for the endurance Benifits. So far I have managed to remain 100% true to the diets win no deviation and maintain a max of 10g Net Carbs a day with the highest total never exceeding 40g.
I have found that my weight has plateaued at around 69kg which I happy to be at and recently had to increase my Protien intake to account for recovery and muscle Maintanence. I recently bought Keto sticks just out of curiosity to see where abouts I’m at and the results wernt quite what I was expecting. My results were in the lighter scale which after 5 months of following this diet I’d assumed would’ve been higher.
I understand that excess Protein will be utilised by the body as glycogen however I was wondering what addition amount that would equate to and would my additional amount be more torriable when compared to a non endurance athlete as any additional Protein I consume is post exercise and assumed it would be utilised by the body straight away.
I used to be a be a sugar fiend and since the switch have not had one sugar craving which for me is such a result in itself and love the life style & foods on this diet as well as the endurance benefits enabling me to train on empty/fasted state for multiple hours. I guess I’m just after a few pointers to make sure I’m actually in ketosis/fat adapted and not living in a bubble world!
Many regards
Tim
Any web site suggestion for weight lifting routine on ketosis diet?
Regards
I started the keto diet.and have been on it for a week.used a ketostix.and it barely showed a color.it looked like it showed negative.what am i doing wrong.
Hi Frank!
I totally understand your frustration, and it’s difficult to know for sure over the internet. . . but I’d just give it some more time and see what happens. How about you check back in a few more days and see how things are going?
Sometimes we’re so eager to see the ketostix change that we forget it can take some time.
While you’re waiting, double check and make sure carbs aren’t sneaking into your diet in any way, shape or form. Log everything that goes in. That way, when you have questions, you can have another set of eyes on what you’re eating, etc…
Best of luck!
-Michael
I am tryijng to get to a low ketone diet. I drink a lot of water. My urine runs clear in the AM and throughout the day. Does that affect the color changes on the Ketone strips?
Thank you so much for this website! I love the information that you have here. It has made me a whole lot less nervous about doing this diet (the media does nothing to help this).
My husband and I started this diet last Sunday and already both of us have lost about 6 pounds each. I suspect at least some of this is water weight, but still all good. We used the keto stix a few days ago, and I had the second darkest color that night and my husband had the second lightest color, and now a few days later I’m also really light.
So, after reading this post, I think that our bodies become very efficient at keeping the ketones in the body more level. Our bodies are a truly amazing, resilient, and adaptable!
Thank you, Gail!
I wish you and your husband much success on your new way of eating. And you are right… our bodies are truly amazing, resilient and adaptable!
Please check in again and tell us how you and your husband are doing.
Best of luck!
-Michael
I have been doing the Keto diet for 3 weeks now and I have only lost 4 pounds. I use myfitnesspal and keep an eye on my macros everyday. I am eating around 1000 calories a day. My micros are always the 75% fat, 20% protein and 5 % carbs. My keto strips never stay purple for more then a day. Very frustrated that I am not losing inches around my waist at all. Any hints as to what I can do to change this? Do I need to back off the fats a little? I am 5’6 and weigh 137 pounds, extremely active( P90x3 in the mornings). How will I know when I am in Ketosis?
remember reading in adkins old book that salad 3 cups is 15 c’s still do not understand this since iceberg so low in c’s; assuming he means no heavy c dressings think 15 is high thank you michael .. love this blog
Hi Joyce!
Thanks for stopping bye and joining the conversation.
This isn’t the first time that some of Dr. Atkin’s earlier statements leave us wondering… As visionary as he was, something like this would certainly be a head scratcher. I can offer no explanation that improves upon your own, but I’d certainly like to read the exact quote in context. Maybe I’ll be able to find it.
With that said, I’ve heard Dr. Eric Westman say something quite similar… and in that case, I can only assume that he misspoke.
-Michael
Is it possible he was putting something other than lettuce in the salad? Some of the veggies on the Atkin “foundation veggies” list are high carb enough that they’re not usually recommended to eat in large amounts on keto.
Hi I have a question about what drinks I can have. I was told Crystal Light like other when you beginning we look forward to seeing the pink/purple on the stix. I was on 15 when I drunk a Crystal Light I was all the way negative. How much weight can I lose in 3 weeks? I posted this article in my fb group. It is awesome and very very educating. I never like reading nor do I enjoy it, this article took my attention and it stayed here. Love it great job.
Hi Diana!
First, thank you! That is incredibly kind of you to say.
If I understand your question, most people should be able to drink Crystal Light without a problem. Just make sure to read the label and that it says, “zero calories”. If it has a calorie count, you need to see where the calories are coming from…most likely, sugar.
Mind you, there are some people that report getting thrown out of ketosis when consuming some artificially sweetened beverages…but these tend to be outliers. Still, it’s worth keeping in mind in case you stall or have difficulties losing and can correlate that to consumption of some specific consumption. Then try stopping that and see if anything changes. If it does, it suggests causation…
Make sense?
Let me know if it’s not clear, or you have additional questions!
-Michael
Thanks so much! I am looking and feeling great but the strips aren’t showing any ketones at all as they were previously. I thought it had something to do with PMS. I will check back in a week or so just out of curiosity but after that I’m pretty much going to ditch the stix. Perhaps I will save them for the newbies I encounter and inspire. Thanks again.
Great content! Just what I needed to read 8 weeks in. Thanks
Could someone comment on the use of Erythritol (Truvia).
Specifically, the use of Truvia instead of Stevia liquid.
I had quite the opposite effect. I was in large ketosis (according to the strips) for over a month. I was slowly losing weight, but I felt like garbage.
Aches, hot flashes, spacey, no energy. I can’t understand why my body wasn’t using the ketones it was dumping.
I cycled off for a day, and I feel a lot better, but I think I may have put a pound or two back on….I’m NOT checking… But I am confused.
Hi Tammy,
You may find the explanation you’re looking for in Dr. Berg’s YouTube videos on ketosis and fat loss. He often remarks that the body has to first get healthy before it can metabolize fat efficiently. I did a five day fast last year, and was a wreck after day 3. I never “adapted” like the experts said would happen by days three and four. I suffered horrible heartburn, dizziness, heart palpitations, brain fog, and zero energy. Finally ended the insanity on day five, had lunch, and immediately felt better. Now I know (after watching Berg’s videos) I was missing critical electrolytes, and was too insulin resistant from years of grazing (snacking all day, which keeps insulin high) to jump into fasting ketosis like I intended. Since last summer I’ve been steadily lowering carbs in my diet, but wasn’t seeing progress because I didn’t understand how my frequency of eating was keeping me from weight loss. My body was burning the fat I was eating, but not burning any of my stored fat because of my snacking and drinking tea/coffee with generous amounts of cream, AND my weight started creeping up even though my carbs and calories were going down! Anyway, this summer I finally committed to going full keto, then moved into a ten day keto “fast mimicking diet” (FMD) with minimal problems. What a relief to see the scale start moving in the right direction and my waist size shrinking. I’ve moved cautiously from the FMD to Berg-style nutrient-dense keto, and things are continuing in the right direction for me. Learning to change my eating habits and eat a larger volume at one sitting than I’m used to, followed by no snacking, has been a challenge. The keto sticks have been enormously motivating, keeping me from straying too far. I’m happy as long as I get at least a trace result. Thanks to the posts of people like Michael, here, I understand the k-sticks are just general indicators. Thanks for the enlightenment, Michael, and good luck on your health journey, Tammy!
I started eating low carb Atkins bars for 2 weeks. Carbs low. Stayed well under 20G but was knocked out of Ketosis. What gives? And what other low carb foods will do that ?
Hi BlüLotus!
That’s an excellent question, and sadly, one for which there is likely no uniform answer. Many people, like you, report eating “low carb” foods and getting knocked out of ketosis. For many, this is the result of sugar alcohols, which are (or were) a component of Atkins bars. If you aren’t familiar with them, sugar alcohols are artificial sweeteners that produce less of an insulin response than regular sugar, and have fewer calories. For many, they are an excellent sugar substitute (provided you avoid the explosive diarrhea that they can cause). For others, quantities in any amount cause the aforementioned intestinal distress and seem to knock them out of ketosis.
There are many explanations and theories about why this is floating around the net. I’m far from an expert in any of them. Suffice it to say that your experience is what matters: if the Atkins bars keep knocking you out of ketosis, avoid them. It is likely that one of the artificial sweeteners they use (or some other ingredient) is doing it. Other foods (or simulated food-shaped objects, like Atkins bars) that contain the same or similar ingredients will likely do the same for you.
This is part of the process of learning what foods are appropriate for you in the keto lifestyle. There are general guidelines, that are useful for getting most of the people headed in mostly the right direction. And then there is the individual’s unique experience and bionindividuality, which will dictate your unique dietary needs and responses to the general guidelines.
So in short, pay attention. If Atkins bars knock you out of ketosis, it’s likely the sugar alcohols in them. Avoid eating them in the future, and avoid eating other food-like substances that include the same or similar ingredients.
Good luck, and check back in with any further questions or observations!
I have started keto twice, the first time in August 2017 for 3 months, as an experiment. I have spent years trying to find the right “diet” (=lifestyle) for me and this has been the only one that has worked. Since then I’ve read a number of books and tried all the options. I’m back on (close to) zero carbs now and have again reached my weight target on Keto, along with a fairly rigorous exercise schedule (weights, boxing, running). I use a monthly urinalysis as a check, it tells me (and I am only interested in) if I have ketones (+,++, or +++) or protein in my urine. Since my weights are improving, I think I am not undereating protein, but my body weight continues to decline (from 145lbs to 119lbs today). So I plan to increase my protein from 80gms to 100gms daily, and check to see if I reach proteinurea on my next analysis. Is this a dumb idea? I really don’t want to add more carbs as I feel just great as I am, just don’t want to lose more weight.
Thank you so much for this. I had never used ketostix in the past, and was freaking out because I’m 4 weeks in and no longer registering any ketones on the strips. Thank you for this clarification and I am going to look into that book now!
Just one small question … if I don’t have any fruit at all … can I get scurvy. This woke me up last night. Thanks vm.
Ha!
That’s an excellent question. I don’t know that you’d actually get scurvy, as there are a lot of sources in a ketogenic diet to get Vitamin C and the requirement for Vitamin C is lower in a low carb diet than a carbohydrate-rich diet. Couple this with the research that shows that a low carbohydrate diet can be nutritionally complete and you can be dismissive of outright fears of scurvy-addled low carbers crawling out of the woodwork.
With that said, it takes some effort and planning…and there are a no shortage of ways to eat low carb without being nutritionally complete. Because of this, and and because I don’t want to take any chances, I use a daily vitamin regimen that includes Vitamin C.
You might want to consider doing the same.
Hi Michael,
This is my second week doing Keto and I do use ketostix. Matter of fact the first few days after buying them I was so excited I think I tested every tome I had to go to the restroom. Ha!
I read on here a lot of people saying they test dark purple all the time. I have never tested “dark” I tend to stay in the middle. I know you’re probably not going to be able to tell me anything about that but I was just wondering and hoping I guess for any insight? If not that’s ok. It still shows I’m in Ketosis, I just never have the “dark” purple.
I like the advice given earlier to just make sure to be less than 20 carbs (or less) a day and I’ll sray in Ketosis. I believe I haven’t been eating enough. Just waiting on grocery day to start a new “menu.” There’s so many out there I really get lost in it all. Thank you for the post. I think I was obsessed (obviously) testing but now I’ll just probably do it once a day until I get more used to all of this.
I’ve been on keto for 3 weeks today and have shown deep purple on my ketone test strips since I started testing, which was a few days in. My husband started shortly after me and is no longer showing ketones in his test strips. I understand he may be adapted at this point. Should I be concerned that I’ve been consistently dark purple? Is this bad for me?
I am currently in the same situation! I’ve been on Keto for 4 weeks and I have been dark basically the whole time. I’m just wondering what that means and if I could possibly be fat adapted? I feel okay. I did go through the “keto flu” and feel like I have come out the other side of that. I lost some weight in the beginning and I’m still eating the same things and working out every other day doing resistance training in a gym but still not seeing much change bar the first initial Weight loss. I don’t have as much mental fog i feel like but I just don’t feel like the energy that you read about has come yet. And everything I have read thus far has been totally contradictory. I am counting macros and calories and I used a macro calculator to get those numbers. I’m just needing some straight answers I can understand! Thanks in advance!
Hi, hopefully you still read these comments,
First, thanks for a no-nonsense explanation! I have been on keto for about 3 weeks, started producing ketones after a couple of days & suffered the ‘keto-flu’ on day 3 until I got my electrolytes & water consumption sorted. I’ve also started eating 16:8 but yesterday ate one meal at about 4pm & went 21 hours until breaking fast at 1pm.
However, on testing my ketones (ketostix) in the morning, I showed beige for the first time (I’ve normally tested dark to light purple consistently). I’m very curious as to what might have caused this from a 21hour fast. Could it be that my body simply had no spare ketones to flush away?
Ok I am brand new to keto but have done something called trim healthy mama in the past where you seperate fuels. Most of my meals were low carb. For many days at a time. I have been eating a “normal” diet for the last 7 months or so and just started keto less than 5 days ago. I got testing strips today and the first test was dark purple! It kind of concerned me because the information I watched and read said it would be very hard to get to this level of ketosis right off the bat… one person even said his mom achieved a ketosis testing (blood) of 7.8 after fasting an entire week from food and water. Mine was around an 8.0 on my first test. The reason I am concerned is while I have no reason to think I have diabetes, my grandmother was hospitalized and eventually died after being in a diabetic coma from ketoacidosis. I guess I have this inner fear saying “what if it’s high because you have undiagnosed diabetes or what if keto is making it worse!?” My blood sugar normally stays at 105 fasting.
My question is, is dark purple at 8.0 normal for someone’s first week? Is there anything I should be concerned of? Also, I totally understand you can’t give me medical advice and I’m not expecting that, just want to know from your experience how normal this is. (I also tested a few times right after and it was a lighter pink!)
Ashley,
Thanks for reaching out!
Not unusual. I’ve read many anecdotal accounts of similar results, and have had them myself. More often than not ketone test strips start out strong and over time (and as your body adjusts to consuming ketones and limiting the overproduction of them) the test strips continually get lighter and lighter. But remember, everyone is different, and all our bodies react differently…and ketone test strips are a rough tool at best.
So if you’re on the other end of the experience spectrum and you have only trace ketone amounts at the start, that doesn’t mean (necessarily) that you’re doing anything wrong. Keep at it, look at the results, and consider your test strips to be a rough guide. (Obviously, if you’re not seeing results, make darn sure you’re limiting carbs, etc…)
As for your family history specifically and any medical concerns you may have, I’d recommend you discuss your diet with your physician and/or healthcare provider. He/she is best equipped to understand your specific context and can help address any concerns you may have.
-Michael
I know this is an old post, and my question may have been asked. I tried to read/skim through the comments too.
I’ve been doing 40 net carb keto for over a year. I’ve lost weight, but very very slowly. My nutritionist had me cut to 1400 cal and increase exercise. It has budged a little more, but only about 2lb/month on average.
Maybe every 6-8 weeks I hit a day I can’t stand my food and ultimately eat a bunch of fruit, nuts, and dark chocolate. I’m sure way over my carbs and calorie limits. But, I go right back to my macros the next day or so. Sometimes it knock my keto strips to negative. But so sometimes it doesn’t.
This is my question, I’ve been extremely consistent despite a few spread out, short high carb days for over a year and when I’m on point with my macros my keto strips still will hit dark purple. I’m almost always between 4 and 8. Am I not fat adapting?
Worried my exercise is too much, but it was slow before exercise too. I am getting stronger and more toned. I will go a few months with no weight change, then drop a few pounds suddenly. Then stagnate again.
Rebecca, if your strips are dark (purple) you are not fat-adapted. If you ever were, you are now in “reset” due to being knocked out of ketosis due to over-carbing on cheat days.
I have been on a strict under-20 carb clean keto diet for 6 months now, and I have very little ketones in my urine as I am now fat-adapted.
The bottom line: When your body re-sets, you should see a higher rate of ketones. If you stay on track with your carbs and don’t cheat, you won’t keep getting thrown out of ketosis and have to start over. Once you are fully fat-adapted, you will see very light results on a keto strip, since your body is no longer sending ketones into your urine; your body is utilizing them.
Good luck! You’ve got this 😉
I’ve skimmed the comments and responses, and still feel my question is a little unanswered. I just want clarity, is it okay or not for my test strips to test as dark purple? Why am I finding so many medical warnings for people who are not even diabetic? If I’m not diabetic, is ketoacidosis a possibility if my ketones are high and or remain high?